How can bratty subs/slaves be disciplined effectively?

How can subs/slaves that that are insubordinate just to receive discipline be handled, so they are still disciplined, but don't receive the pleasure they were hoping for?

It is all too common a scenario, a sub or slave playing up because they enjoy the attention of being scolded or at the receiving end of discipline. While some find it fun to have a feisty sub, many find it annoying and disrespectful. At best it shows a lack of consideration towards ones Owner, and at worst it represents a clear case of an attempt to Top from the bottom.

How can this sort of sub/slave be dealt with? Disciplining them places their Owner in the situation of being manipulated into a situation that is not for their own pleasure but for their subs. Every Domme has their own way of dealing with this, so this is more of an expression of ideas. Clearly denial of the subs preferred means of discipline is important. If the sub is to be disciplined then it should not be an enjoyable experience in the slightest, and preferably an experience they will regret for a long time.

Can a sub self administer discipline? Is it a fitting mechanism, to lock them in a room with recording equipment and an alarm clock set to ring every hour, and make them wake every hour on the hour to self administer discipline in front of the camera. The sub can have a painful task such as tiger balm to be applied to various places, or various insertions. Each hourly discipline to be recorded on cam, so that its Mistress may verify it at any point if She desires, and he needn’t be present to gain any satisfaction from Her viewing his pain. Would this be a discipline many brats would enjoy? Hopefully not.

Most good subs/slaves would find the idea of being away from their Mistress to be a terrible punishment, and this can be a very effective means of discipline. Is this always enough? Will it really drive home a lesson especially in a case of severe insubordination? Will the sub be too scared of loss of contact with its Owner to ever repeat its insubordination?

With a male sub is it better to hit him where it really hurts? Even the best trained of sub boys enjoy cumming, no matter how irrelevant it may be to their Mistress. Long term denial of orgasm privileges may be a good punishment for these boys, but because of the time to reach peak frustration it may be a while before they truly learn the lesson they need to learn.

These are just thoughts, perhaps an invitation to comment on what methods others have found best to deal with such subs.